Cambridge vs Oxford – Melanie Sindelar on the most famous IVs

Datum: Dec 2nd, 2011
Category: Themen, Turniere

Two of the most prestigious debating tournaments took place over the last weekends, the Oxford (November 10 and 11) and the Cambridge IV (November 18 and 19), and Achte Minute was there! Because there is a long tradition of comparison between the two Universities of Oxford and Cambridge, also this report will try to compare both tournaments since IV stands for intervarsity, a competition between universities.

The first tournament that took place was the Oxford IV – which started on Friday (for international arrivals on Thursday evening) and took place at the impressive Oxford Union buildings, including the big and famous debate chamber. Unfortunately, the Thursday Night Chamber debate and the promised presentation of master studies as well as the cocktail party were cancelled, but the OrgCom tried to comfort the people with a college dinner and a free drink.

Friday afternoon started off with the first two preliminary rounds, in the evenings they provided free drinks (lots of them) and a social at a club nearby.

On Saturday, the rest of the tournament took place with a break in between to catch oneself some food in the town, where the Union set up some deals with local restaurants and take-aways. In the evenings, we got the promised hog roast, and there was so much left that everyone could have a second one too. In between there was also a social at the Union bar, and then the main finals started, which in the end were won by Sydney A (Daniel Swain and Elle Jones), who defeated Durham A (Pam Cohn and Guy Miscampbell), UCD L&H C (Mark Haughton and Aengus Boyle) and Cambridge D (Joe Roussos and Asish Kumar). The ESL final was won by Leiden A (Rogier Baart and Ali Al Khatib) defeating Utrecht A (Danique van Koppenhage and Thomas Beerthuis), BBU A ( Calin Muresanu and Radu Cotarcea) and Open Comm A (Goran Jankuloski and Milan Vignjevic).

After the announcement of the winners, the tournament ended and people were asked to leave the premises. For some reason people lost their crash persons and ended up sleeping at some other persons places.

VDCH teams at Cambridge IV 2011: Upper row: Rauad Abagela (Kiel), Henrik Maedler(Independent Judge, former IUB), Melanie Sindelar (DK Wien), Thomas Schäfer (Tilbury House) Lower row: Niels Schröter (Berlin), Isa Loewe (Mainz), Jonas Werner (Berlin), Janni Hinselmann (now in Bristol)

Cambridge IV then started one week later, for those who booked the international package, they also enjoyed the Union Thursday night debate.

On Friday evening, the first two rounds started, between there was time to get something from the grocery stores nearby and also tea and cake was provided. After the two rounds, everyone enjoyed staying at the Union bar and get free drinks with the ‘free-drinks buttons’ we were handed out beforehand. For the sake of humanity, the rounds on Saturday only started at 9 am (Oxford started their rounds at 8 am, and yes one hour makes a huge difference), but we were reminded by Bob Nimmo, the famous tab master who calls himself ‘the small angry men in the tab room’ that we better ought to really turn up promptly at nine. (Which most of the teams managed to do so.) Also the OrgCom provided a cereal breakfast that was big enough for everyone to get a bite, even the last-minute arrivals.

Later in the afternoon the main break quarter-finals and ESL semi-finals took place. The English seem to be obsessed about hog roast, so again there was a delicious hog roast dinner (and, in both Oxford and Cambridge, a veggie alternative), that led over to the finals and the black-tie social with champagne and free drinks, as well as good music! Those who didn’t want to leave for bed after the social followed some debaters to an after-party.

The open final at the Cambridge IV was won by BPP A, Jack Watson and Doog Cochran. They defeated Oxford BC (Steph Bell and Jen Coyne), Oxford BW (Ben Woolgar and Hugh Burns) and Loyola (James Kilcup and Dearbhail O’Crowley) in the final. The ESL-final was won by UDS A (Danique van Koppenhagen and Tomas Beerthuis), defeating Berlin A (Niels Schröter and Jonas Werner), Bucharest A (Serban Pitic and Radu Tiganas) and BBU C (Ioana Georgescu and Bianca Prunea )

In terms of organization it seemed that the Cambridge IV was better organized, convener James Hardy had an open ear for everyone, even for some homeless debaters from Austria, getting them last-minute crash. Thanks!

The Cambridge IV as a whole was more popular in VDCH country, with teams joining from Berlin, Vienna and Kiel. Berlin A (Niels Schröter and Jonas Werner) broke into ESL finals and took places 3rd and 4th on the ESL speaker tab. Also, the final was chaired by Isabelle Loewe (from Debattierclub Bonn, EUDC winner 2006, ESL). Congratulations to everyone!

With regard to a recommendation to which of the IVs you should visit next year: visit both of them and form your own opinion about the tournaments and squeeze in a visit to London between!

Here an objective comparison of both tournaments:

Oxford Cambridge
Accessability on web FB-Page, normal page broke down FB-Page + Homepage with details
Prelim Rounds 5 to 7 minutes 5 to 7 minutes
ESL-Break yes yes
Reg Fee
Standard Package 85 85
including 2 socials, hog rost, crash for 2 nights, free drinks Saturday Night Black Tie Social, free drinks, Hog Roast, crash for 2 nights
International Package 105 110
included Crash for 3 nights, Thursday night debate, cocktail party, College dinner, lecture on Master programs Crash for 3 nights, Thursday Night Debate, Debating Workshops, Tour of Cambridge
Cancellations from Org Thursday night debate, lecture on master programs, cocktail party none
CA`s Sayeqa Islam Harish Natarajan
Ben Woolgar Shengwu Li
Hugh Burns Nathalie Smith
Winners open Sydney A (Daniel Swain &
Elle Jones)
BPP A (Jack Watson and Doug Cochran)
Winners ESL Leiden A (Rogier Baart &
Ali Al Khatab)
Utrecht (Danique van Koppenhagen and Tomas Beerthuis)
Team & Speaker Tabs click here click here

Motions Oxford IV 2011

  • Round 1: This believes that sex education classes in schools should teach techniques for pure sexual gratification (including, but not limited to, anal sex, oral sex, mutual gratification and masturbation).
  • Round 2: This house believes that in developing countries aid organizations should be banned from religious proselytizing.
  • Round 3: This house believes that trade unions and labour protection laws should be suspended during times of economic crisis.
  • Round 4: This house believes that Israel should materially support Arab pro-democratic movements.
  • Round 5: This house believes that a tax should be placed on successful artists in order to fund new and developing artists. (Note: Artists defined by the CA team to be the arts and the entertainment industry)
  • Open Quarters: This house believes that International Law should allow states which accept refugees to sue the states they come from for compensation.
  • ESL Semis: This house believes that the LGBT movement should not support pride marches.
  • Open Semis: This house would establish brothels on military bases.
  • ESL Final: This house believes that the CEOs of the largest corporations should be chosen by the national democratic elections.
  • Open Final: This house would establish geographical zones where the selling and consuming of any and all drugs are legal.

Motions Cambridge IV

  • Round 1: This house would allow family members to forcibly commit proven alcoholics and drug addicts to rehabilitation clinics.
  • Round 2: This house believes that all research organizations should institute codes of conduct that forbid the creation of strong AI.
  • Round 3: This house would provide financial assistance to inner city neighborhoods to prevent gentrification.
  • Round 4: This house believes that China should make extracting a full apology for Japan’s war crimes a top strategic priority.
  • Round 5: This house believes that feminists should not campaign against polygamy in poor countries.
  • Open Quarters: This house believes that the use of conscripted soldiers should be a war crime.
  • ESL Semis: This house would take the children of the Amish into care.
  • Open Semis: This house regrets the rise of a distinct African American culture.
  • ESL Final: This house believes that it is morally legitimate for Occupy Movement to use violence to undermine capitalist institutions.
  • Open Final: This house would break up Google’s search monopoly.

msi / apf

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3 Kommentare zu “Cambridge vs Oxford – Melanie Sindelar on the most famous IVs”

  1. Witthaut says:

    Awesome motioins at Cambrigde IV!!!

  2. niels says:

    cambridge esl final teams waren uds a und berlin, die anderen beiden teams kamen aber aus bucharest und bbu c (auf dem tab nach namen schauen). im oxford open final waren mark h und aengus boyle im ucd team.

  3. Melanie says:

    schönes fettnäpfchen, danke für den hinweis, schon korrigiert…

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